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Chaining families - AT vs AR

Discussion in 'General' started by feitian87, Mar 16, 2019 at 7:36 PM.

  1. feitian87

    feitian87 F2pl0rd VIP Supporter

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    I was just wondering, since the meta would shift from DR chaining to AT chaining, why is AT chaining the next best? Compared to AR, which is 30-hits and AoE, why is AR not considered the top chaining family?

    For the longest time, only DR chaining was mentioned. Tidus brought QH chaining, but that died with the fix to any spark chaining tricks. OS had ST and AoE frames, but was always considered to have low modifiers. As for mages, Chaos Wave was the "go-to gold standard" since I read that Tornado chaining has low modifiers and Quake was hard to chain.

    So now, with the arrival of PG Lasswell, A2, Sora and soon Akstar, the chaining meta will chain from DR to AT. Why? What makes AT chaining top? Personally, I dropped my Orlandeau for OK and switched from DR to OS simply since I prefer the elemental versatility and the option to do ST or AoE chains (preferring AoE). And since I was able to spark chain too, so probably I could live with the lower modifier.

    But now, I just wonder, what were the factors that made people agree or decide that AT is the next meta chaining family? Number of hits? Able to self-imperil? Easy to chain? Back-loaded (self-cap)?
     
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  2. Shr

    Shr Spooky Spooky Arena Runner Up S3 VIP Supporter Monthly Arena Champ S2 Monthly Arena Champ S1

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    Because the good units from now on until the next "new" chain will all have AT and AT is easier than DR to chain even
     
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  3. Noctisftw

    Noctisftw Ascended Member

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    AT chaining primarily becomes meta due to ease of chaining and that it is the largest chaining family currently on the jp side. As for AR, while has a high number of hits it is difficult to chain with dual wield and multicast. Not to mention most AR moves have low modifiers.
     
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  4. Regalia

    Regalia Member Supporter

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    It's been mentioned, but the main consideration is "how many meta (high stats, good modifiers, multicast) units use this family?" The more there are, the easier it is to put together a team and find guest units to chain with.

    The new power creep coming out of JP mostly use AT, so AT is the new thing.

    DR was big for exactly this reason, a huge number of powerful units use it.
     
  5. TheRunawayGirl

    TheRunawayGirl KINGDOM HEARTS 3 BABY! VIP

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    Pretty much what was said before.
    Also, something that wasn't mentioned. AR is normally elemental locked to 2 elements. Don't believe me? Well, then... Let's see it:
    • Lunera - Light/Wind
    • Lid (NOT CG) - Can only get it via Invention, and has to be enhanced
    • Viktor (LIMITED) - Has it based DEF, non-elemental
    • Malphasie - Either Wind or Dark locked
    • Lilith/Lucius - Fire/Dark
    • Loren - Wind/Lightning
    • A.Fry - Non-elemental
    • Kunshira - Lightning/Wind
    • Felix (LIMITED) - Non-elemental; needs setup
    • Qin (LIMITED) - Enables it for 1 turn after a 2-turn setup with Moonlight Waltz
    Out of that list, only 3 have it non-elemental inately, 1 has it after a 2-turn setup for the entire team. However? Aside from Lid, all are limited. And Lid is a 3-5* unit, and you'd need to enhance it. And even then it's random.
    As for AT... It's easier to chain, has elemental versatility (except for Auron), and will become a HUGE family in te future.
     
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  6. victor sant

    victor sant "Hall of Fame" Member Supporter

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    AR only work with spark chaining, as QH. Also, the 30 hits from hits are highly overated. It barely adds anything to the damage in the end compared to other common chain families.

    Also, there is the power of the skills. AT chaining skills are in most case very powerful, while AR are generally very weak. Chaining only multiply the damage, if the base value is low, the end result will be lower.
     
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2019 at 11:02 PM
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  7. Flame_alchemist

    Flame_alchemist Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the list one of my favorite things about AR chaining by going with your list is those units are either support or tanks meaning we can bring finishers to compensate for the low atk mod.
     
  8. Rezquiorra

    Rezquiorra Ascended Member Supporter

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    AT become meta because most new meta unit strongest move was AT frame and also have stacking modifier..
     
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  9. JimmyL

    JimmyL "Hall of Fame" Member Supporter

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    AR is great for story and arena, you get unlimited supply of lb crysts/esper orbs

    For serious fights, stick to meta chainers chaining DR/AT.
     
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  10. Absolem

    Absolem "Hall of Fame" Member Supporter

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  11. aa25

    aa25 VIP VIP

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    This. I always found AR family very awkward. I asked a similar question a while back why people excited about AR family, the answer back then was Loren (back when she was still the only one with 70%+ break).
     
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  12. feitian87

    feitian87 F2pl0rd VIP Supporter

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    Thanks everyone for the useful replies and info.

    So even if I can spark chain perfectly, AT always has more damage than AR overall?
     
  13. BigNBald5

    BigNBald5 Guess Im destined to be FinisherL0rd VIP Supporter

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    2 different thing buddy. AOE chaining for the most part is almost always lower in mod because it is AOE 1st of all. 2nd AT is single target and most AT chainers have to ramp up, meaning if they die or do something else, the mod goes back to the beginning.

    Thing is global got a big kick in DR chaining with Fryevia, A. fryevia, Jecht's global buff, and even Rena having spr based AOE DR chain (my Rena has 1649 spr so it does good damage). AT chaining gets is huge liftoff once Akstar is here, and if you have 7* Dracu Lasswell and/or 7* Sora, thats when u can really take advantage of AT chaining (Dracu Lasswell and Sora 7* can use Triple cast). PG lasswell has a huge mod on his unlockable AT chain but he is dual wield so only double cast in our T-cast meta.

    Whichever way you go, most likely u will have enough firepower to win anyway so what does it really matter?
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2019 at 7:21 AM
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  14. aa25

    aa25 VIP VIP

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    Very very likely. Most AR chainers are DW/TDW units and the mods are around 6-7x. AT chainers are mixed TDH/DH and TDW/DW, some of them even have triple- or quadruple- cast, and the mods can be as high as 13x. If you can spark chain perfectly, it implies you can do the say with AT chain too. Single- and Double-elemental-spark chain reach dmg cap at 7th and 5th hits, repectively. So, there is really no difference between Single- and Double-element-spark chain. (They do have some difference for non-spark chain though, but, then, AR chain will break).

    Edit: Just want to give you the land scape: Nyx's Kingsglaive, Tidus's Quick Hits, and Aileen's Piledriver+2 all have around 7x mod. So, 6-7x mod is probably around average at best.
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2019 at 3:05 AM
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  15. xV3N0M

    xV3N0M Ascended Member

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    Way to confuse me, you said Aloha Lasswell then went on to speak about PG Lasswell ::ink::
     
  16. Arkadi

    Arkadi Ludicrous Speed! VIP Supporter

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    Aloha Lasswell does not have AT chains, only DR. Dracu Lasswell and Pyro Glacial Lasswell have AT frame attacks. PG Lasswell would prefer to use the unlocked Absolute Mirror of Equity but still has Obliterating Mirror of Equity to fall back on for AT frames.
     
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  17. Frosty Toast

    Frosty Toast Ascended Member Supporter

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    I agree that Akstar is part of the reason AT is awesome in JP.
    However, he is not the powerhouse.
    He sparks a wave of AT units that follow after, making it hands down the strongest family on JP.
    Just look at Chocobo Fina ::rudecat2::
     
  18. Lumina

    Lumina Ascended Member Supporter

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    This. AR is really nice for missions. (For now) DR chains are better for trials
    Having the AR family being mainly AOE while also being mainly on Support units is kinda nice. For the Giga Rat, for example, you could use your ST chainers to deal with the Giga Rat while someone like Loren and Lilith could be chaining (even if non elemental chain) to kill the other rats.


    If only the elements were better sorted or we had more non elemental AR units, I think they could be useful situationally, specially against bosses with many of those "minions".
     
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  19. project 86

    project 86 VIP VIP

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    because AT chains on several units have back loaded damage like Akstar
     
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  20. BigNBald5

    BigNBald5 Guess Im destined to be FinisherL0rd VIP Supporter

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    I apologize, i meant Dracu Lasswell in the 1st place. Dracu lasswell can triple cast, pg lasswell cannot. There was no mistake there. Sorry if that wasnt clear enough initially
     

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