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Esper Training / Esper Skill Tree Recommendations

Discussion in 'Guides' started by Sexwulf, Jan 22, 2018.

  1. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    Siren

    (Name links to Wikki)

    Best used on support units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Analyze - useful to deduce weakness in enemy and to see how many HP are left (important when trying to finish a boss off with an esper kill or LB kill
    2. Dispel - Remove all status effects from one enemy. A VERY useful skill.
    No other skill is worth getting. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Siren's esper effect does do damage therefore her stats impact the damage she does based on the type of attack the esper does.
    Her attack does magic damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on her damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over her weak skill set.

    Siren makes your unit 50% weaker to lightning and 50% stronger to water.
    Avoid when enemy uses lightning attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses water attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +31 (out of a potential +35)
    • MP: +34 (out of a potential +34)
    • ATK: +18 (out of a potential +20)
    • DEF: +21 (out of a potential +21)
    • MAG: +37 (out of a potential +37)
    • SPR: +38 (out of a potential +38)
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    Ifrit

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Physical damage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Beast Killer - Increases damage by 50% to beast type monsters
    2. Plant Killer - Increases damage by 50% to beast type monsters
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Ifrit's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type of attack the esper does.
    His attack does physical damage therefore Attack and Defense have twice the impact on his damage than Magic and Spirit.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Ifrit makes your unit 50% weaker to Ice and 50% stronger to Fire.
    Avoid when enemy uses ice attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses fire attacks.
    He also grants you a 10% resistance to blindness.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 3 unused points. (3 points - WTH Gumi?!)
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +50 (out of a potential +50)
    • MP: +22 (out of a potential +23)
    • ATK: +54 (out of a potential +54)
    • DEF: +31 (out of a potential +31)
    • MAG: +22 (out of a potential +22)
    • SPR: +22 (out of a potential +22)
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    GOLEM

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Tank units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Stone Slayer - Increases damage by 50% to stone type monsters
    2. Insect Slayer - Increases damage by 50% to insect type monsters
    3. Provoke - Increase chance of being targeted (70%) for 3 turns to caster
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    I also strongly recommend you avoid "Cover" like the plague. It seems nice at first blush but there are times you will want to use this esper on units that you don't want to have covering other units.

    Golem's esper effect does not do damage therefore his stats only impact is to boost the unit's stats.

    Golem makes your unit 50% weaker to Wind and 50% stronger to Earth.
    Avoid when enemy uses wind attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses earth attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +64 (out of a potential +64)
    • MP: +44 (out of a potential +44)
    • ATK: +34 (out of a potential +34)
    • DEF: +49 (out of a potential +49)
    • MAG: +17 (out of a potential +17)
    • SPR: +17 (out of a potential +17)
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    SHIVA

    (Name links to Wikki)

    Best used on Magical Damage or Healing units.​

    Skills worth getting... None. I flip back and forth on the following but eventually settled on none due to their effectiveness being so low its just not worth having them cluttering up my ability inventory
    1. Imperil - Decrease resistance to all elements (20%) for 3 turns to one enemy
      • Not Really. There are almost always better imperil options than 20%
    2. Deshell - Decrease SPR (20%) for 3 turns to one enemy
      • Not Really. Sounds good being that she is a mage esper but there are almost always better spirit breaking options than 20%
    3. Libra - Ok this one is useful but your mage is probably a damage dealer so its not likely to be the one to use this skill anyway.
    Her other skill are definitely not worth getting. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Shiva's esper effect does do damage therefore her stats impact the damage she does based on the type of attack the esper does.
    Her attack does magical damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on her damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over her weak skill set.

    Shiva makes your unit 50% weaker to fire and 50% stronger to ice.
    Avoid when enemy uses fire attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses ice attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 1 unused point. (1 point - WTH Gumi?!)
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +39 (out of a potential +39)
    • MP: +31 (out of a potential +31)
    • ATK: +23 (out of a potential +23)
    • DEF: +25 (out of a potential +25)
    • MAG: +56 (out of a potential +56)
    • SPR: +56 (out of a potential +56)

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    Ramuh

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Magical damage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Dispel - Remove all status effects from one enemy. A VERY useful skill.
    2. Osmose - Magic damage (0.3x) as MP drain (30%) to one enemy. Great for mages who have run low on MP. And it only costs 10 mp to cast.
    3. Drain - Magic damage (0.8x) as HP drain (30%) to one enemy. To a lesser extent. This probably won't heal you enough to make a huge difference but in an emergency it does only cost 5 MP to cast.
    Skills to avoid:
    1. Banish is probably weaker than any other spell your mage can cast.
    2. Faith is only a 20% boost to magic for one ally. Absolute garbage.

    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Ramuh's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type of attack the esper does.
    His attack does magical damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on his damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Ramuh makes your unit 50% weaker to water and 50% stronger to Lightning.
    Avoid when enemy uses water attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses lightning attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +30 (out of a potential +32)
    • MP: +63 (out of a potential +63)
    • ATK: +18 (out of a potential +18)
    • DEF: +13 (out of a potential +13)
    • MAG: +61 (out of a potential +46)
    • SPR: +46 (out of a potential +46)

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    Diablos

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Magical Damage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Man-Eater - Increase physical damage against humans (50%)
    2. Demon Killer - Increase physical damage against demons (50%)
    3. Osmose - Magic damage (0.3x) as MP drain (30%) to one enemy. Great for mages who have run low on MP. And it only costs 10 mp to cast.
    4. Drain - Magic damage (0.8x) as HP drain (30%) to one enemy. To a lesser extent. This probably won't heal you enough to make a huge difference but in an emergency it does only cost 5 MP to cast.
    5. Mug gets a special mention because it does have a neat arena trick. Mug cannot be evaded. It always hits (even vs a 100% evade unit). Nice for whittling down those pesky arena evasion units.
    Skills to avoid
    1. Reduce encounter seem nice and all but you are a some events rely on exploration encounters. Some times you want encounters. Leave "reduce encounter" to material you and equip and unequip.
    2. Darkside is a waste. It looks nice but its a physical attack (not magic). So its based on your attack stat. Therefore going to do garbage damage on your mage at a cost of 30% of your max (not remaining) HP.
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Diablo's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type of attack the esper does.
    His attack does magical damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on his damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Diablos makes your unit 50% weaker to light and 50% stronger to dark.
    Avoid when enemy uses light attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses dark attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 10 unused points. (You could get "sleep" if you really want to burn those last 10 points on a spell you will never use)
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +47 (out of a potential +47)
    • MP: +62 (out of a potential +62)
    • ATK: +17 (out of a potential +17)
    • DEF: +24 (out of a potential +24)
    • MAG: +54 (out of a potential +54)
    • SPR: +33 (out of a potential +33)
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    Carbuncle

    (Name links to Wikki)

    Best used on Support and Healer units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Analyze - useful to deduce weakness in enemy and to see how many HP are left (important when trying to finish a boss off with an esper kill or LB kill
    2. Barfira - Increase fire resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    3. Barblizzara - Increase ice resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    4. Barthundara - Increase lightning resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    5. The Last Stand - Increase DEF/SPR (20%) when HP drops below 30%. Not a lot but every little bit helps and its a passive so it doesn't clutter up your ability list with worthless crap like Deshell and Protect. Some may say use Cura but you are gonna put this esper in your healer so Cura is straight up a waste of space.
    6. Cura (Yes I caved on this). @kurizu brought up some valid points about Cura in posts below. He suggested that (especially when running on a physical unit it gives an extra heal spell. He pointed out that during King Mog events its a great way to add a heal to "Bonus" units who may have no heals. He pointed out that you can put Cura on units like Zidane/Locke/PirateJake/Xon to heal units when doing Story events to increase loot. I hadn't considered this angle. It was inspired.
    No other skill is worth getting. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Carbuncle's esper effect does not do direct damage therefore her stats only impact the bonus to your unit.

    Carbuncle makes your unit 50% weaker to dark and 50% stronger to light.
    Avoid when enemy uses dark attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses light attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +34 (out of a potential +34)
    • MP: +58 (out of a potential +58)
    • ATK: +19 (out of a potential +20)
    • DEF: +33 (out of a potential +33)
    • MAG: +45 (out of a potential +45)
    • SPR: +64 (out of a potential +64)
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    Odin

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Physical units.​
    Skills worth getting:
    1. Dragon Killer - Increases damage by 50% to beast type monsters
    2. Undead Killer - Increases damage by 50% to beast type monsters
    3. Lance - Physical damage (0.8x) as HP drain (20%) and physical damage (0.3x) as MP drain (10%) to one enemy. This is huge for DPS cause it lets them refill their own MP.
    4. Bladeblitz - Physical damage (1.4x) to all enemies. You will use Odin on physical attack units, many of whom do not have an AoE attack. This covers that need.
    5. Fingersnap - Physical damage (1.1x) to one enemy. Remove all status effects from one enemy. Its basically dispel with some damage but unlike dispel you can cast this on your own party members to remove debuffs and conditions (like stop).
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Odin's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type attack the esper does.
    His attack does physical damage therefore Attack and Defense have twice the impact on his damage than Magic and Spirit.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Odin has no elemental weaknesses or elemental resistances.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +55 (out of a potential +55)
    • MP: +40 (out of a potential +40)
    • ATK: +63 (out of a potential +63)
    • DEF: +43 (out of a potential +44)
    • MAG: +21 (out of a potential +21)
    • SPR: +23 (out of a potential +23)
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    Titan

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Physical and Tank units.​
    Skills worth getting:
    1. Barstonra - Increase earth resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    2. Tulmut - Earth physical damage (1.6x) to all enemies. Tanks and physical units often do not have AoE attacks. This fills that need.
    3. HP Stroll - Recover HP (5) while walking every 3 steps. Nice when soloing explorations to level units or for tanks to self heal while walking around. Though not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.
    I skipped emergency regen as it only activates when your HP is below 10%. Talk about emergency. If your 8000 HP tank gets down to less than 800 HP then 120 HP, 0.6x per round regen is probable not gonna help much. You will be chugging a potion or directly healing him at that point. Even as a passive Emergency regen is a waste here.

    No other skill really worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Titan's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type attack the esper does.
    His attack does physical damage therefore Attack and Defense have twice the impact on his damage than Magic and Spirit.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Titan makes your unit 50% weaker to wind and 50% stronger to earth (same as golem).
    Avoid when enemy uses wind attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses earth attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +69 (out of a potential +69)
    • MP: +21 (out of a potential +21)
    • ATK: +55 (out of a potential +55)
    • DEF: +43 (out of a potential +44)
    • MAG: +19 (out of a potential +19)
    • SPR: +33 (out of a potential +33)
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    Lakshmi

    (Name links to Wikki)

    Wikki says best used on Support and Healer units
    But I say put her on a Physical or Magical Damage unit.
    Will get into why later.​

    Skills worth getting:
    Almost all of them. Unlike other espers Lakshmi is loaded with useful skills.
    1. Libra - useful to deduce weakness in enemy and to see how many HP are left (important when trying to finish a boss off with an esper kill or LB kill
    2. Auto-Regen - Auto-heal (120 HP, 0.6x) per turn. No need for your HP to be low - its always on and it stacks with other regen spells.
    3. Demonic Whipser - Refresh (10 MP, 0.3x) split over 3 turns to one ally. Not much in the way of batteries but every little bit helps.
    4. The Big 3 Protections: (God sends for those without resistance gear)
      • Softening Protection - Increase resistance to petrify (100%) for 3 turns to all allies
      • Walking Protection - Increase resistance to paralyze (100%) for 3 turns to all allies
      • Assuring Protection - Increase resistance to confuse (100%) for 3 turns to all allies
    5. Cura (Yes I caved on this). @kurizu brought up some valid points about Cura in posts below. He suggested that (especially when running on a physical unit it gives an extra heal spell. He pointed out that during King Mog events its a great way to add a heal to "Bonus" units who may have no heals. He pointed out that you can put Cura on units like Zidane/Locke/PirateJake/Xon to heal units when doing Story events to increase loot. I hadn't considered this angle. It was inspired.
    Her only skills that are crap are Mediguard, Stona, and Banish. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Lakshmi's esper effect does not do direct damage therefore her stats only impact the bonus to your unit. Her esper effect does heal the whole party 100% though. This brings me to why I recommend her on a tank unit. Healers already heal. Why give a healer an esper that heals? And support units are freaking busy enough holding the party together every round. They don't have time to do an esper heal. Physical and Magical damage units however.... They have the luxury to skip a round of attacking and do something no damage unit can do. Heal the whole party! And don't discount the MP refresh passive that Lakshmi gives units (something most healers and support have and most DPS dont have)
    Lakshmi - best Esper for Damage Dealers Ever!

    Lakshmi has no elemental weaknesses or elemental resistances.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    Some people have argued Cura over Mediguard as mediguard is only ~+100 HP per round. If thats your choice go for it. IMO its a passive that heals a little for free whereas Cura is a very weak heal that no one uses by this esper's point in the game. Its just another spell you will have to scroll past to get to the one you really want. But feel choose your own build. These are just my recommendations.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +51 (out of a potential +51)
    • MP: +51 (out of a potential +52)
    • ATK: +21 (out of a potential +21)
    • DEF: +23 (out of a potential +23)
    • MAG: +35 (out of a potential +35)
    • SPR: +59 (out of a potential +59)
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    Tetra Sylphid

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Mage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Bird Killer - Increase physical damage against birds (50%)
    2. Camouflage - Decrease chance of being targeted (50%)
    3. Baraerora - Increase wind resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    Skills to avoid:
    1. Divine Selection - This would be nice if it was a magic attack but its a physical attack. You will use this esper on a mage who will do absolute crap damage physically. This ability is a trap. A wasteful trap.
    2. Call to Ruin - Same reason as above. Physical abilities on a mage esper WTH Gumi?
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Tetra's esper effect does do damage therefore their stats impact the damage they do based on the type of attack the esper does.
    Their attack does magical damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on his damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.

    Tetra makes your unit 50% weaker to earth and 50% stronger to wind.
    Avoid when enemy uses earth attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses wind attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +41 (out of a potential +43)
    • MP: +55 (out of a potential +56)
    • ATK: +27 (out of a potential +27)
    • DEF: +21 (out of a potential +21)
    • MAG: +63 (out of a potential +63)
    • SPR: +36 (out of a potential +36)
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    Bahamut

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Wiki says best used on any units
    Though I recommend using on any but your damage units.
    I will explain why below.​

    Bahamut is pure stats - he has no skills on his tree.

    Bahamut's esper effect does do damage therefore his stats impact the damage he does based on the type attack the esper does.
    His attack does magical damage therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on his damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.

    I chose Spirit, Defense, and Magic for my paths because I recommend not using this esper on your physical damage units. This esper has no skills, no passives, and only a single digit boost to stats over other espers. The entire and only reason to use him (other than that dragons are cool) is to drop a nuke esper effect. Bahamut is not an esper for your damage/chaining units. He is a "chain capping esper." You will typically want to nest this esper damage into a nice chain to maximize the damage and therefore won't want this esper on your damage/chaining units.

    Bahamut has no elemental weaknesses or elemental resistances.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 30 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +64 (out of a potential +68)
    • MP: +63 (out of a potential +67)
    • ATK: +64 (out of a potential +64)
    • DEF: +64 (out of a potential +64)
    • MAG: +64 (out of a potential +64)
    • SPR: +64 (out of a potential +64)
    [​IMG]



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    Fenrir


    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on physical or magical damage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Pick a Howl ability. They are an AOE attack which many physical units are missing. There are some AoE spells available but most mages have better spells. As the howl abilities are hybrid they will work well with physical or magical units and give you that lacking AoE attack.
    2. Dark Howl - Dark hybrid damage (1.8x) to all enemies. You can choose Ice Howl if you prefer but most enemy weak to ice are fire based enemies with fire attacks and Fefnir makes you very weak against fire attacks.
    No other skill is worth getting even if you had the MP to get there. They are so weak you will likely never use them.
    They just take up space when you scroll to find useful skills on your units. Avoid them.

    Fenrir's esper effect does not do direct damage therefore his stats only impact the bonus to your unit.

    Fenrir makes your unit 50% weaker to fire and 50% stronger to cold.
    Fenrir makes your unit 25% weaker to light and 25% stronger to dark.
    Avoid when enemy uses fire attacks.
    Consider avoiding when the enemy uses light attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses wind attacks and dark attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    NOTE: You can choose to get the +1 stat point in Defense instead of spirit if you prefer. I value spirit over defense in most cases so I chose spirit
    NOTE: You can choose to get Ice Howl instead of Dark Howl if you prefer. I chose dark because ice attacks are typically used against fire based enemies and Fefnir lowers your fire resistance by 50%.

    • HP: +49 (out of a potential +52)
    • MP: +31 (out of a potential +34)
    • ATK: +58 (out of a potential +58)
    • DEF: +25 (out of a potential +26)
    • MAG: +57 (out of a potential +57)
    • SPR: +26 (out of a potential +26)
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    Leviathan

    (Name links to Wikki)


    Best used on Mage units.​

    Skills worth getting:
    1. Magic Spirit Killer - Increase magical damage against fairies (50%)
    2. Magic Aquan Killer - Increase magical damage against Aquatic Monsters (50%)
    3. BarWatera - Increase water resistance (50%) for 3 turns to all allies
    4. Osmose - Magic damage (0.3x) as MP drain (30%) to one enemy. Great for mages who have run low on MP. And it only costs 10 mp to cast
    5. Drain - Magic damage (0.8x) as HP drain (30%) to one enemy. To a lesser extent. This probably won't heal you enough to make a huge difference but in an emergency it does only cost 5 MP to cast.
    Skills to avoid:
    1. Current - Very weak 1.2x single hit single target physical water attack. Sure it grants a 30% water imperil but by this point in the game you can do much better on imperils. As this esper is a mage esper physical attack abilities are less than attractive.
    2. Ferocious Currrent - Same as above. 0.2x stronger physical water attack but this one is AoE. Still garbage.
    No other skill is worth getting but you will get them anyway as you have to suffer though them to get to the killers (which are top priority).

    Leviathan's esper effect does do damage therefore their stats impact the damage they do based on the type of attack the esper does.
    The attack is magical based therefore Magic and Spirit have twice the impact on his damage than Attack and Defense.
    HP and MP have no impact on damage.
    This is another reason to focus on stats over his weak skill set.
    SPECIAL NOTE: This Esper will out damage Bahamut if the target's water resistance is lower than 0 or if it can be lowered below 0. With Tidus's 100% Water imperil Leviathinan will dish out nearly double the damage of Bahamut. Something to keep in mid for those battles where you need an esper kill.
    That said some may be tempted to go for the attack tree rather than the osmosis tree as I have displayed.
    Here are some raw numbers to show the difference that tree makes on damage:

    [​IMG]
    As this is a Magic based esper the attack tree only adds about 1.5% to the damage. I would only recommend the attack tree if you have no other source of water imperil to boost the esper's damage.

    Levithian makes your unit 50% weaker to lightning and 50% stronger to water.
    Levithian makes your unit 25% weaker to earth and 50% stronger to wind.
    Avoid when enemy uses lightning attacks.
    Consider using when enemy uses water attacks.

    Here is my recommended tree.
    At level 40 this will leave you with 0 unused points.
    This will provide your units with the following boosts to your unit's stats:
    • HP: +74 (out of a potential +80)
    • MP: +60 (out of a potential +60)
    • ATK: +53 (out of a potential +55)
    • DEF: +32 (out of a potential +32)
    • MAG: +63 (out of a potential +63)
    • SPR: +32 (out of a potential +32)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2018
  2. Mercy

    Mercy Monthly Arena Champ Monthly Arena Champ VIP Supporter

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    So... Basically a comprehensive guide of everything @kurizu has already done?
     
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  3. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    Can you link what kurizu did. I couldn't find anything in forums that was less than 8 months old and what I did find gave no, or terrible, recommendations.
     
  4. Mercy

    Mercy Monthly Arena Champ Monthly Arena Champ VIP Supporter

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  5. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    I did see those guides.

    They were very well done.
    However they are great examples of what I meant when I said "the ones I found gave poor advice or were very outdated."

    Although his guides go into much more detail about the espers, their abilities, and how/where to get them we already have a wikki for that.
    Also many of the links on his posts don't work and most images are broken.

    I found that disagreed with a lot of his choices as well.
    For example he seems to prioritizing weak useless skills over stats on espers that do damage with their esper effects.
    Focusing on "as many skills as possible" may have been a good idea 12 months ago but now those skills are so outdated and weak that only a precious few are worth pursuing.


    On some espers he chose HP/MP stats (that add nothing to esper damage) over other available stats (that do).

    Seems he is under the assumption that the only purpose of stats is the 1% boost to the unit abilities.
    Perhaps he didn't realize that esper damage is calculated based on the espers primary (and to a lesser extent secondary) stats.

    And though the impact is minor and I am nitpicking here, in places he stacked MP and HP stats poorly. He did not capitalize on how the bonus total always rounds up. Perhaps not realizing that stat boosts always round up (ie. +105 to MP = +2 to unit MP so there is absolutely no benefit in grabbing the next +20 and +30 MP ability rather than other stats)


    TL;DR
    I wasn't going for a guide all about espers.
    I was targeting a guide based entirely on how to best train espers to maximize their potential with reasons behind each choice based on todays units and gameplay.
     
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  6. Kiramon

    Kiramon Ascended Member

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    I like your guide, but usually new players look to these — and those same players will likely lack the diversity of units etc where not having Cura (the biggest outlier, IMO) or Stona could hurt them— since most esunas don’t cover stone.

    But hey, still great and will probably get me to reallocate at least 2 of mine that I’ve not touched in a while.
     
  7. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    The only esper with Stona is Lakshmi.
    The only espers with Cura are Lakshmi and Carbuncle.

    They are both pretty deep into the story.
    By the time you are even able to obtain these espers you will have units with better heals than Cura and a pile of golden needles.

    Also to get to Stona you give up on 150 SP worth of training points on Lakshmi and forsake substantially better abilities.
    This for a single target cure petrify spell on an esper who comes with an AoE immunity to stone buff for fewer SP.
     
  8. Pandaranda

    Pandaranda VIP VIP Supporter

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    Cura is great for me despite playing for months. I like being able to heal with support units, especially ones with dualcast but no on the spot healing spell (ie Marie). Sometimes I even heal with mystea since she has free turns in her rotation. This allows me time to do other things besides healing for my main healer ^^

    Apart from Bahamut I don't use any other esper for damage. That said I've always prioritised unit stat buffs over skills, apart from a few gems like killers, dispel, osmose, cura and Libra, all of which I use a lot ^^
     
  9. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    I added this comment to Lakshmi's section
    Some people have argued Cura over Mediguard as mediguard is only ~+100 HP per round. If thats your choice go for it. IMO its a passive that heals a little for free whereas Cura is a very weak heal that no one uses by this esper's point in the game. Its just another spell you will have to scroll past to get to the one you really want. But feel choose your own build. These are just my recommendations.

    I stand by my build of Carbuncle. To get Cura on Carbuncle you would need to give up substantially better abilities. It would be a very bad choice on Carby.
     
  10. Kiramon

    Kiramon Ascended Member

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    To each his own :)

    Marie with dual cast Cura is 4400 ish a turn at my spr and her regen, which results in near full heal for every non tank: :)
     
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  11. Kingguss

    Kingguss AileenlOrd VIP Supporter

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    Nice guide for begginers.
     
  12. Dayne

    Dayne Ascended Member Supporter

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    Nice guide man, thx for all the work you put in it!
     
  13. SNova42

    SNova42 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Which esper besides Bahamut does significant damage? I don’t see a reason to even factor in the esper summon damage at all. Maxing their stats for the damage would make the summon, what, 10% stronger? Against anything worth troubling over espers do less than 100k damage. Sometimes less than 10k. Why not grab a skill that might be useful at some point (for example, banish is very useful for ‘do light damage’ missions) or whatever else you want (like MP, which I think is very valuable. Sometimes even 1 MP makes the difference between being able to cast your spell and needing to waste one turn)

    For kill with esper missions, I think the best way is to time the esper summon to land after the enemy’s dead. It’s not hard since all espers have long animation. The health range where this is possible is much larger than if you actually aim to kill with the summon. Just make sure the enemy’s gonna fall with your next chain, prepare the esper summon (by your tank or support or healer), start the chain and summon the esper. Or summon the esper and start the chain, depending on how fast your chain is. You’ll have like 3-4 seconds of error window, which isn’t that hard at all. I find it much easier than trying to get a boss’s health down to below 10k.
     
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  14. Klaus

    Klaus Polll0rd VIP Supporter

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    I relly liked your Lakshmi guide. Very good idea.

    But...
    It's FeNRIR. Not FeFNIR.
    AAAAAAAAAAQQAQQQQQQAQCHANGEITTTTTTTT
    MYEEEEEEEYEEEEEEEEESSSS
     
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  15. kurizu

    kurizu Fina -> Sniper Waifu <3 VIP Supporter

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    No offence, but your builds shows that you have no idea about how stats works on espers, while agree on the part that most of my oldest guides are out of meta, I could really make a great list of things you went wrong in your description.

    Pointing the biggest mistakes you made:

    This is untrue, Bahamut esper damage are considered magical type damage thus MAG/SPR stats give higher boost over ATK/DEF boost... that difference goes into :
    (6000+6000+6400/2+6400/2)/100 vs (6400+6400+6000/2+6000/2)/100 => 188 vs 184... the difference is that one of 3% in damage which could not be felt due to the damage variance but it still give impact on these.

    Builds of : Siren/Ifrit/Golem/Ramuh/Titan/Lakshmi/Tetra_Sylpheed/Fenrir shows that you even forget about most basic rule of Espers -> for stat to be applied on unit you need to have a value that is divisible by 100, you put tons of points into single stats like single 40spr on Fenrir or 85 spr on Ramuh that give your units 0 points and waste 10-60 esper points. Even more so they are on death paths for their future 3* grids.

    When I saw you suggesting Mediguard on Lakshmi my hands literally went down, on Meta where damage goes in thousands/ten thousands you gave a suggestion of 50hp passive...
    You are argumenting that Cura is bad in current meta ? How about KM runs where you can make your 50/75/100% bonus unit an additional healer ? what about item farming where you can put esper with Cura on Zidane/Locke/PJake/Xon to heal your units when doing Story events with 1 carry and bunch of loot increasing units... I can see your focus goes mainly on single type of battle which wont even use 80% of skills picked by you. Not even considering missions for certain "deal x type of damage" where its easier to put these 5 points on low lvl skill like banish or bio instead of continuously changing your units gears or units itself ^.-

    Picking Mug over Reduce Encounters... Mug only value is arena for attacking these evade units, Reduce encounter is highly recommended for clearing explorations, if you want to farm anything on exploration you only need to switch Diabolos to different esper, there is more benefits on it that from Mug which lost its meaning upon Ashe/Shantotto/Barbariccia/GLS coming to global. Your argumentation "leave it to items" ? Why should I spent my SQ to get more reduce encounter items when I can keep these SQ for more expensive items incoming.
    Darkside being physical is meh ? Please Diabolos is a source of Demon Killer and Man-eater. These killers are, next to Beast Killer, most often used killers on physical units... I cant say how many times you put Diabolos on your PHYSICAL dps to increase its damage...

    P.s The biggest mistake you did was not putting this thread into Guide section, it will drown in General section within 2-3 days > @Arnatuile Can you move this thread to guide section ?

    P.s2 I like intiative itself, concentrated source in single place is good thing. for that I give you kupo nuts for your hard work, spending time on esper guides takes my time~

    P.s3 After reading myself, I again wrote it in very rude way, sorry~
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2018
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  16. Pandaranda

    Pandaranda VIP VIP Supporter

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    Agreed, I often use espers for their elemental skills for story missions and especially story event missions where you can't freely change units and equips between battles. Banish, fire, stonra, blizzara, thundara, aerora, biora (hoping Leviathan comes with a water attack to use too lol) have all been used by my teams for story missions, and cura is definitely great for running teams without a dedicated healer. ^^
     
  17. Elrond

    Elrond Ascended Member

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    I actually get good use out of Attack song (40% attack), deprotect, and imperil for king mog events. For those trying to use Kryla's hex skus, imperil could also be useful since it affects all elements.
     
  18. Arnatuile

    Arnatuile Wolf of Lapis Street Staff Member Moderator VIP Supporter

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    @Sexwulf I moved the thread to the more appropriate "Guides" section of the forum indeed. As usual, just a reminder that anyone is welcomed to share knowledge they might have about the game and should not be discouraged from doing that. In the same spirit, criticism and requests for clarification should, on one hand, be welcomed and, on the other, should try to represent targeted and focused feedback.
     
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  19. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    I will corrected this on the OP. Tree is I proposed is still correct for building for damage but I wasnt aware Bahamut's attack was magic based. I had read somewhere it was hybrid damage.

    You are incorrect about this. Maybe they changed it recently but I tested it when I reset my espers. As soon as you get a positive value it rounds up to the nearest 100. +10 to an esper stat is the same as +100 (+1 to the unit stat). +110 to an esper stat is the same as +200 (+2 to the unit stat) and so on.

    This is a fantastic argument that I hadn't considered. The only reason I ruled it out was its annoying to constantly scroll past junk in order to find the abilities needed. Mediguard is more 75 - 125 HP but I agree even as a passive its trash
    I will update the suggestions to reflect your comments with credit given.


    It has been my experience that people would prefer being able to increase encounter rate especially for exploration based special events and unit power leveling.
    The problem with reduced encounter on an esper is if you dont want it you have to ditch the esper with it.
    Like Cover (an even worse esper ability) its an ability that sometimes you don't want with no way to turn it off.
    If you want to marry yourself to an "always on" passive that you can only turn off by not using the esper or spending 100 lapis then go for it. My reasoning was simply "I don't take a passive that is sometimes counter productive" Whether or not you want to take Mug is up to you but I strongly dislike restrictive passives.


    When using on a physical unit for the killer effect the damage of Darkside is still very low (Dark physical damage (1.5x) to all enemies). It doesn't chain (1 hit) and is a terrible finishing move. Al this for a high 30% cost to HP with every use.
    If you are using it on a physical unit for the killers then pretty much any 3*+ physical unit will have better, more efficient attacks. Still cant recommend darkside as a skill worth getting even when using it on a physical unit. Its outdated trash.


    Nah that was not a big mistake - that was an accidental over site. And thank you Arn for moving it.

    My biggest mistake was finishing it and posting it while I was drinking. When I reread my comments I came across as insulting and shitting all over your guides which was not cool.

    For that I cry pardon.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2018
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  20. Sexwulf

    Sexwulf Ascended Member

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    Odin does decent damage.
    Certain espers do good damage when the enemy is weak to their element though you take a risk using them in those cases as they often make you weak to that enemies attack.

    If you prefer to toss out a few % damage increase and a 1-2 points of extra base stats for your unit in favor of taking skills you will likely never use than go for it.
     

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