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Princess of Hourne: Machérie Guide WoTV

Discussion in 'Guides' started by SummonerBWM, Jul 9, 2020.

  1. SummonerBWM

    SummonerBWM VIP VIP Supporter

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    The princess of Hourne and the daughter of Robb, she has been crapped on so much by players believing she doesn't bring anything to the table. However, studying and using her, Macherie is actually the type of healer everyone is overlooking. This guide is to show how to properly use her and to understand her role. Also, Macherie can trash Xiza any day 1v1.

    Max Stats
    Element: Light
    HP:2111
    TP: 174
    AP: 122/158
    ATK: 143
    MAG: 272
    AGI: 53
    DEX: 174
    LUCK: 152
    MOVE: 3
    JUMP: 1
    Equipment: Hat, clothes, Mace
    Master Ability: 10% TP, 10% AP
    - 10% Dark Resistance
    - 10% Slash Resistance
    - 10% Pierce Resistance
    - 10% Missile Resistance
    10% Magic Resistance
    15% Strike Resistance
    13% Crit rate
    50% Blind Resistance
    50% Confuse Resistance
    15% Charm Resistance


    Main Abilities
    TMR: If you grab her TMR, it will be pretty nice on anyone, including any tank. Gives good HP, good DEF, nice SPR, and also crit evasion as well. The ability when you max the TMR can reduce damage by 30% for 3 turns and also heals in a fight.
    Esunaga: This allows her to remove every ailment in-game but in AoE form! Ayaka needs her TMR on her to be able to AoE remove ailments compared to Macherie.

    Calamity Guard: This allows her to help her teammates to be immune to those ailments that can hinder the battle. This allows her to help any DD or tank not be hindered in finishing off the enemy.

    Erase: This is what makes her super powerful. She is able to remove all debuffs AND it is AoE.

    Fist Counter/Magic Counter: She gets hit, she pimp slaps back or blow them up. They synergize well with the Strike Mastery and MAG UP passives for more damage.

    Auto-Cure: If she's ever in danger when she gets hit, she can heal some of that damage back. This for her can mean life and death to make sure she can make it through another round.

    SPR Up Lv. 1: What she has over white mages is the passive ability to increase her SPR. This ensures she will take less magic damage in a fight. Very nice for her.

    Strike Mastery: Players will be wondering why she needs this when she's a cleric, but it synergizes with her Monk class, enabling her to deal more damage. As she always says, she doesn't need anyone to protect her.

    MAG UP: This will work very well if you have her BM as the sub-class. Enables her to deal damage from afar.

    HP UP: Gives her more HP to continue living.

    LB: This is a strong strike attack but what is also good with her is that she significantly, if maxed, increase all of her resistances by 45%. When used at the right time, she can lower any damage by enemies who are focusing in on her while her teammates help take down the other enemies.

    PvP
    In a PvP fight, she is actually can be good in any fights where the other team is using light and dark units as having the cleric as a sub-job for her allows her to use resistances against them. Players would underrate her but what is special about her is that having Monk as her sub-job can help take advantage of unit's weaknesses to strike attacks. Mediena, Oelde, Rain, Aileen, and anyone with weak strike resistance will despise her for this. Players may be wondering why anyone would want to put that on her but she has two ranged attacks as a monk: Surge Strike and Terra Slash. The other interesting thing is her Terra Slash is not just a strike attack, but also can deal piercing damage. This can surprise someone behind another unit in range off guard.

    If you have her go the BM route, then she can send those such as Xiza and anyone with weak magic resistance to the grave, especially since she gets more Banish uses and 2 higher level banish spells. Since she also has good strike and magic resistance, she will not be going to be taken out by attacks favoring those two, and dark units will have an even harder time to go up against her if she ever takes the cleric sub-route to give AoE dark resistances.

    However, her other weaknesses to the other attacks can be a problem. Vallaide's TMR can help a bit in rounding out her weaknesses. VCs with party abilities affecting certain resistances can also help her out too. When going the monk route, her ATK can be lacking, which means she will need to rely on the strike passive and any esper or VC who can help boost her ATK or striking power. Her LB also lacks range, so for her to even make use of it, she either gets up close to someone or if the enemy gets up in her face for her to make effective use of the resistances. She moves slowly like a mage, so be careful.

    Versatility, Synergy, & Job Combos
    If you read her PvP section, you can see why she is good. Players think of clerics as healers but since she only has Cure, they see her terrible. What we need to realize is that there are two different types of healers in this game: WMs are better at healing while clerics are better at removing debuffs and ailments while also giving resistances to those ailments. This means that while someone like Ayaka will be healing, Macherie can be there to help Ayaka remove anything hindering the party Ayaka can have trouble with. A WM and Cleric together ensure the party can keep on fighting and more firepower from Macherie.

    She may have HP in the low 2k but her HP passive can help her out a bit to hit mid-range. She is a ranged attacker anyways. Her MAG passive when equipped will allow her to climb 300 and going either BM or Monk will always be good for her to hit from afar dealing damage.

    Pure Cleric: Going this route means she can AoE give light and dark resistance and also Pronged Staff to reduce an enemy's AGI. It is also strike damage, so it works and she has her Banish ready to go. The only thing is that this path does not offer many attacks for her although those 2 skills do have 8 uses each.

    Cleric + Monk: When players think of monks, they think of those getting up and personal. Macherie does not have to in this case. She receives more attacks and the two ranged attacks I mentioned in the PvP section mean she can still fight safely from afar. Do remember that her ATK is lower than her MAG, so anything that can boost her ATK or strike power through VCs and espers will benefit her.

    Cleric + BM: This has to be my favorite. She gets more uses of Banish and two more higher levels of it. Also, she has Drain to heal herself and since those spells have a lot of uses, this makes her more magic-offense oriented to allow her to deal more damage while also still retaining her power to removing ailments and debuffs.

    Esper Synergy: Ramuh, Shiva, Lamia, Malboro, Ochu

    VC Synergy: Mobius: Despair & Truth, Ramuh, Scions of Shadows, Trousseau, Malboro, Behemoth, Flag of Wezette

    Unit Synergy: Fryevia, Fina, Ayaka, Grace, Ramza, Thancred, Adelard, Cadia, Helena, Y'shtola, Margritte, Naiah, Phoebe, Leela
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2020
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  2. Eredar

    Eredar Ascended Member Supporter

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    How is her dress still white after she smashes that mobs head... ::rudecat7::
     
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  3. kamizumi

    kamizumi Well-Known Member

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    I want to say i disagree with most of this and leave it at that, but that is a broad statement and without some reasoning provides very little use for any newish player reading your guide thinking (oh wow i have a Macherie I'm gonna be great, good....ok).

    so lets look the first statement "overlooked healer" she has cure and.....yeah where is curada, cura, curaga, full life. Her TMR skill is 1 use so id have to say she doesn't really excel at doing much in terms of heals for any party as compared to other even lower tier healers (grace, cadia, phoebe) that carry multiple combinations of those mentioned skills and are much cheaper to build.

    Macherie win vs Xiza! again i highly doubt this. all things equal; xiza users will most likely build dodge and sub thief at high lvl pvp. Xiza has 74 agi from board which already means she can almost double Macherie(58) if built correctly, throw steal time and steal heart(82% to land as Macherie has 15 charm resist) into the mix, snipe dagger and the fact that Macherie has -slash resist and lacks any guaranteed hit ability like some other mage types....did i mention Xiza's TMR.

    STATS: macherie stats also offer nothing much to the table, she has lowish hp, low agi, middling mag, low atk, low movement. She isn't really a healer so i have to compare to a mage. Mediena/Miranda both have generally better stats (more hp on miranda/agi/movement, and even some MR units can surpass her (salire))

    ABILITIES: Her skills are not unique really...Cadia, a MR unit has esunaga and in fact, most of her skills are held by other units that do them much better/faster(due to proper passives) and offer more to a team comp in terms of damage, healing and general support.

    PVP: I have seen Macherie in arena...and my heart leaps for joy when i see her cause i know its an easy win. Most well built units can 1 shot her including the multitude of very strong dark units global has (Sterne, Gaff(mr unit)). My Whisper in samurai sub for instance hits her for around 4k with oborozuki. The majority of ppl will be under extreme pressure to build Macherie to survive any serious PVP encounter.

    Versatility etc: yes she can support to some degree but since even MR units can keep up and even surpass her support capabilities this is why ppl prefer not to build her. A good example is the ongoing tower event where u may want Ayaka to do some holy spam on the dodge units..well Macherie wont be able to take over any serious healer role for Ayaka to do this while so many other units will. Even the status floor with toad can be handled by someone else that will fully cover the role better than Macherie while still providing better all round support.

    Cleric; she barely has any heals, no speed cast and can only provide some buffs to specific elemental type damage which already really limits her usage.
    Monk; low base attack and the highest dmg mace i could find for her has only 138atk and maces give magic atk + not strike + so she doesn't get any support for monk from that either which leaves her atk really low (281 before esper and vc)so even if u could pull off her monk tree she wont be hitting very hard with it.
    Black Mage; again low base stats hinder her and yeah this is probably her only viable line if you are forced to use her. However it should be noted that almost any other UR mage will outperform her (Mediena base mag with full board is 447 while Macherie is at 334) also maces offer less overall mag stat compared to staves which most black mages use.

    All of these issues are not the only things that make Macherie an under performing unit. The AI also hurts here as in most situations I've noticed she prefers to buff rather than attack even if she can and is in range and this game is 80% AI driven.

    This unit can be used manually but if any other option presents itself pls use the other option and save yourself time, energy and in game resources. Some of the above may not apply to whales as you can bypass the stresses of building this char somewhat, though you may still be disappointed with the result.
     
  4. SummonerBWM

    SummonerBWM VIP VIP Supporter

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    Correction. Xiza by herself at max on board and level is 67 AGI. 67 and 74 is not double than 58.

    It is not 82% to land. FTH has an effect on whether debuffs can land or not, so Macherie's charm resist is not really 15 if her FTH is high. I don't even know how you even get 82% in the first place as Steal Heart has a 50% chance, so that, with Macherie's charm resist and whatever hight FTH Macherie has makes that number go even lower, so Xiza is not going to be charming any time soon. If Xiza's FTH is lower than 50 and Macherie has something like 70 FTH ((40+70)/4=2.5), she has a 27.5% chance and Macherie's 15% charm resist makes it 12.5. Also, you talk about Snipe Dagger, yet Macherie has a 50 in confusion resistance while Snipe Dagger has 25% chance. Take the math with FTH for debuffing and... yea. You need to research understand how debuffs works because Xiza is DEFINITELY not going to hit 82% or any other high number. Even so, Xiza has to get in close in order to hit her, and Macherie's LB allows her to boost her attack resistance even more to take less damage. Not only that, Xiza will need higher FTH to even attempt to inflict those two debuffs and that means she will take more damage from Macherie, who can throw up a 38% dark resist to lower Xiza's damage output.

    I don't fully know how the AI is going to act (As it is a hit or miss) but I do know and remember that Xiza from the AI always wants to cast Store first and then attempt to run in. Even if it is on a player vs. player basis, I know how to keep my Macherie away from any Xiza users and use my other units to make sure they can't. Also, Macherie can wear hats to boost her evasion, so if I want Xiza to be swinging at the air more often, I can throw Sage's Hat and even have her or someone have Shiva's card on them to increase the evasion rate.

    Also, if you attempt to rely on Xiza to use slash resistance, you are not going to get much damage out of her. Anyone can throw a Snow-Guard on Macherie or put an esper with slash resistance on her to have that not effective.

    Xiza's TMR is just a heal. Macherie's TMR is a heal with a damage reduction for 3 turns. Xiza's TMR may be healing for 3 turns but Macherie will be taking 30% less damage for 3 turns.

    Macherie is both a healer and a mage. Clerics are still healers in that they focus on removing debuffs and ailments while putting up resistances to those, light and dark attacks more so than HP healing.

    Macherie's support passive allows her to have around the same HP as Miranda and out of the other 3 units you brought up, she's the only one who can have SPR for a support passive.

    Mediena suffers the most with super low resistance and also has low movement; Miranda suffers from attempting to be the jack of all trades and she has the same movement as Macherie; Salire is only better with MAG. She suffers the same thing as a mage with MOVE and suffers more than Macherie in resistances, especially in berserk and paralyze and even less HP.

    Because Cadia's main job is cleric and even then, there's only 2 of them who has access to it. No other units do not even have access to it as a sub-job. That's what makes the two of them unique. A healer like Ayaka will struggle having to throw Esuna one at a time while Macherie and Cadia can throw Esunaga to remove any ailments on everyone, allowing the healers to continue healing or do whatever it is the player wants them to do.

    1. No one has the capacity of having access to different tiers of light spells like Macherie. Macherie is the only light spell caster and she has the most uses of spells out of all of the mages.

    2. She's the only one who is capable of being built in offering healing against debuffs, is more self-sufficient with passives and BM, and also the only one currently who can take advantage of a combo of light and strike weaknesses in Monk (Besides Engel) and light and magic weaknesses in BM.

    3. Because her spells as cleric require TP, she can be more AP-efficient than other units. SHe also has more TP than other units.

    Players will have to build her with Ochu or Golem to help her get some resistance or DEF, Trousseau or Scions of Darkness to make use of dark resistance while also building up her attack dmg or Snow-Guard for more slash resistances and her HP passive to give her some survivability against those trying to one-hit in AI PvP. Alexandrite Ring is good on her or anyone for that matter as it means more dark resistance and Vallaide's TMR can help her resist even more. That's what I would personally do and since she has Dark Veil, she can cast it to help her defend against any dark units as that is her specialty anyway and also to reduce the damage down. AI PvP is a hit or miss but actual PvP going against the actual player is a different story. It's the lack of understanding of how to have different builds on her to handle different units is why she tends to die in any AI PvP or PvP in general.

    Macherie has never been in support. Do not make cleric out as a support job. Macherie has always been healing (in removing ailments and debuffs while providing light and dark resistances) and damage dealing. I never did state that she is a support unit as she does not have the skill to boost stats up.

    If there's a tank doing the tanking and provoking and a player even has Macherie's TMR on them, Macherie's Cure can be decent enough to help them get through if one wants Ayaka to spam Holy. And even then, Ayaka cannot handle debuffs and ailments the way Macherie is able to do it and Macherie has AoE spells to hit, so the combo of both works.

    Not true. Macherie is made to remove toad while either providing heal or damage as she is the one who carries Esuanage and Erase. The only one who can help remove Toad is Mediena and Salire and anyone whose main job is cleric like Cadia.

    Also, she's the only one who can help give resistance to two types of damage while other units only give resistance to only one.

    She does get support for Monk. Her passive for strike boosts her damage in that and Macherie's own mace is not in-game yet.

    Mediena has even lower HP than Macherie and Macherie can use her HP passive to have even more going to 2422 as well as being the one having an SPR passive as well. Macherie going to the BM side will have more opportunities to keep casting spells as she has another use of Banish. Macherie's advantage over other mages is that she will not be going to get resisted so much since her damage is light while someone like Mediena will have to fall under the category of her ice spell being resisted by another element and has a better crit rate to allow her to hit harder. If anything, Macherie has better survivability.

    The AI is going to do whatever it is it wants to do for whatever reason and the patch for us to toggle on and off abilities has to come soon to make it easier, so that part I am not even going to bother worrying.

    If players like you only see the game as running on AI in order to pass through things and believe that is the only thing that makes a unit useful, you are going to struggle more than other players who know how to effectively use them without the need of an AI. You wouldn't attempt running high tower levels on AI or you'll be shocked as to what happens while yet knowing the AI will do something dumb. You wouldn't run AI on high-level raids either.

    Players should not rely on AI so much to get through content and players need to learn how to find different builds and make the full use of a unit. When it comes down to actually doing AI PvP stuff, need Macherie to deal more damage? Shiva, Ochu, or Ramuh for esper, DD VC like Troussaeu will help. Need her to have more survivability? The three espers I mention will help as they give resistance to whatever attack the player needs resistance to, Snow-Guard or any VC that can give it (Troussaeu is great against dark units for mages). Need her to have lower CT time? Let one of the other units carry Becoming Stronger Than Anyone Else. There are many different combos and setups to help benefit different units and the lack of a player's knowledge on how to build a unit to handle different content does not make a unit useless at all. It doesn't even take whales to build someone like Macherie as you want to claim it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2020
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  5. kamizumi

    kamizumi Well-Known Member

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    First off just making sure..are you trolling? if you are then I'm sorry for breaking the fun, if not then please make sure information posted is as accurate as possible to assist all readers (You post guides after all).

    I included Xiza passives from board and master ability as you also referenced Macherie passives and master ability. As i said all things being equal...the "double" i referred to was that at some point depending on what each char (Xiza and Macherie) did during their respective turns, would equal Xiza having 2 turns to act vs Macherie (This is not guaranteed and depends on a great many things including gear, skill usage and unit movement but the fact that Xiza has much higher agi would swing the odds in her favor for it). As a note 10% of a units agi is added to their ct bar each cycle so generally the higher the agi the faster a unit can get their turn.

    Highly inaccurate
    High faith increases damage/healing applied from magic, damage/ healing received from magic, rate of activation for magic based counter abilities and chance of applying and receiving status effects. This is well known in the community now so I'm unsure why you would say otherwise.

    Your math after is also inaccurate, while the base formulae is correct and is what is usually applied to skills that apply status, both Steal Time and Steal Heart fall outside this rule (there are only a few others but i can name doom as 1 of them). For Steal Heart it is simply [user faith + target faith]*50%, another special note about this skill is that it bypasses dodge mechanics(now you get the picture why thief classes are considered important). Again I'll refer to tower where on floor 20 Vinera(ai built with very high dodge) and Medeina, with both high faith values are easily charmed for a cheese strat on clearing that lvl.

    That said even if you could gear Macherie in some semblance of a dodge build she would still have a very high chance of being afflicted with charm, basically 97+97(yes Xiza would build high faith)*50%=97%, subtract Macherie charm resist (15%)we get ..........82%. I'll add that Xiza also does not need to close with Macherie to afflict her as steal heart has a range of 3 while Macherie lb that you say is so good has a range of 1 and uses physical type attack and as you point out her mace that might help her does not exist in the game currently.

    Xiza TMR does not heal......it places a 25% ap restore on the unit for 3 turns that allows for insane strats in pvp/pve where otherwise u would be limited.

    After this i basically just skimmed through as i figure 99% of ppl already know about how useful Xiza TMR is so you have to be trolling me. But regardless i stand by my statements Macherie is not a good unit. Why would anyone take 1 expensive to build UR unit to a battle to do 1, maybe 2 things that several other units including mr and even sr units can also do, are cheaper to build and provide additional options to enhance your party. This basically covers all comparisons and as we know from ffbe its all about role compression to squeeze that extra kick from your party to clear content.

    Referring to specific espers and vcs is also not very helpful as that would require the player to not only have the unit, but be able to craft exact gear(expensive and time consuming) and have a wide selection of resources to utilize to pull off those builds you cite (atm this is still mostly whale territory)

    Most of the content that regularly repeats is easy auto ai farming stuff..i mean really who wants to farm 1725 armor books manually. Do you manually farm this stuff? The duel arena is auto ai, guild battle is auto ai, the content you refer to is not regular recurring weekly content, its mostly seasonal stuff and of course it should be done manually but lets be honest the average player will spend maybe 80% of the time playing content in auto mode. That fact doesn't make any player bad neither does it reflect on a players knowledge of mechanics.

    I also see you referenced my personal play style and earlier in your text my supposed lack of research(a big no to this! as a content creator you should keep to facts please and i have 0 interest in petty confrontations). However you do not know me...i have completed tower twice and have a maxed crimson saber since last week, i love manual play and honestly prefer it but i accept the fact that its simply more efficient to auto most content.

    With your comments i just cant help but think you don't actually play this game.
     
  6. SummonerBWM

    SummonerBWM VIP VIP Supporter

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    It is a heal. It "restores" ap. That's why I call it a heal. I do not mind to say that heal would not be the right word for it if that's the case.


    No. Pretty much you are. Why? Because you purposefully ignored this:

    Please make sure you are accurate in making sure you have read everything and did not skip anything for the benefit fo this discussion and to readers.

    1. You said double as though her AGI is double in your post and that is inaccurate and you weren't clear.

    2. That still does not change the fact Xiza has to get close in Macherie's space to do that, and beginners who do not know that would end up having Macherie allowing Xiza to get close to her.

    3. I know about the CT bar. Even Claic on Youtube made a video about it months ago. Xiza will have 7 added while Macherie has 5 added, which is a difference of 2 between them. That is not significant at all and Xiza still has to get in close and personal to get to Macherie to cut Macherie's CT and considering the two cards where it can reduce the CT for units to get their skills off, Macherie will be able to still get her spells off before Xiza.
    My math is DEFINITELY not inaccurate as far as the formula for faith goes. As for the formula you were talking about, there is no mention of that formula anywhere on the GL side, Discord, the spreadsheets, or on Youtube, so I and another member had to go on Altema to translate and see this:

    https://altema.jp/ffbewotv/heartwonusumu

    However, you're wrong yourself. The person who tested it in JP stated that when used on Macherie, it came out to 67%, not 82% Why? Because you left out this part (Rough translation of Altema):

    This means a Fleeting Tranquility at max gives 15%, so Macherie having it equipped ends up reducing the charm skill by 60%.
    Once again, please make sure the information posted is as accurate as possible to assist all readers.

    Macherie or a unit can use Beguiling Witch to take advantage of the CT reduction party ability; Fennes Castle gives a small amount of strike resistance to the team; Leonis and Wezette Castle gives both DEF and SPR to a unit, which Macherie can use if one wants to take her to withstand damage. And also, this is not whale territory as everyone is pulling from the same banners and it still relies on RNG. A F2P can pull for a VC or unit and can get it in 3 tries while someone who pays in-game summons as many time as they want and finally get the VC in 20. Even talking about crafting the gear is irrelevant as anyone can buy the recipe, everyone is on equal grounds in farming on the weekends for gil, and have access to the same story stages, store, expeditions, and events to get what they need. Everyone even has access to the same skip tickets as well.

    Also, Macherie provides options that the other unit lacks as she is more self-sufficient than the others on top of the other things I've mentioned. I never did make this guide to state who is better than who as it is up to the players themselves to see if they are able to invest their resources. The other units have as many weaknesses they have in which Macherie or any other units dominates in. MR and SR have fewer stats, may not have Whether someone wants to use a unit or not I don't even care; leaving out info as you did with that formula and also ignoring what has been stated is another thing. And once again, please make sure the information posted is as accurate as possible to assist all readers. Ironic for you to talk about role compression, yet Macherie can be compressed as a cleric who can take advantage of those who are weak to light and strike hits or a cleric who is great in light magic and can sustain herself through Osmose and Drain.

    Multi battles players may not even want to AI based on what is there, esper battles you do not want to AI, Actual PvP is not AI. There are parts even in the story where you don't want the AI to be running as they can skip buttons and make the fight harder (The one against the Iron Giant in the story for example. The AI will just skip over it and step into one of the spikes to kill. The AI does not factor in using the environment to fight against the boss). This guide or any other guide for that matter has never been based on AI, which is the only thing you cared about. These guides are about the power of a unit and the effectiveness of a unit. Towers and Raids are something players DEFINITELY care about and is one where they better not dare let the AI run it. I don't even make the guides with the AI in mind as I personally do not know how the AI is going to respond with each individual unit and how it operates. The AI system is trash and the AI update needs to hurry. Cabbage/AOJ on Youtube makes WoTV, play both GL and JP version and he shows events and units that are over on JP and gives us his opinion and input on how to handle them and what he thinks, and he does the same thing I do in going into details on how different units operate when he does his reviews at Lv 99 with a unit. What does reflect a player is if they actually try to rely on the AI so much for harder content that they are far too dependent on it to even know that the AI will not going to follow suit and can get your team killed.

    ::joy:: The irony! Seeing as to how you want to confront me about your own opinions, yet you can't even keep to the facts that are important such as the charm resistance part, which you left out, as well as ignoring statements I've made about said unit so don't even try that. Abide and apply your own statement to yourself first before you use it on anyone else, so you are a big lie. I don't even care who you are and don't really care about knowing you, much less as to whether you completed the tower or not or even accomplishments. Treating players is more important to me than anyone else, which you show you lack and that is what I do know based on what you show me. You came to my thread wanting to debate and argue and you kept hush on most of the parts I've talked about regarding Macherie (And don't say you don't do this because you kept trying to say Macherie is not a healer when clerics is a known fact to be healers with a different role and then only attempt to say that Macherie only does one to two things when I have pointed out more than that, so you should keep to facts on that one). You even ignored the part about Macherie covering Ayaka's weaknesses, so you're someone who prefers to ignore facts or statements just to have yourself appear right. You may play the game but you sure don't know everything while attempting to be big-headed as if you do.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2020
  7. kamizumi

    kamizumi Well-Known Member

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    I think this is getting abit out of hand, this is the second time your responding and making mention of my personal nature of which you have zero knowledge of, in a derogatory manner. As such i wont post any more replies to this as i think you will continue and the world atm has so many negatives, i see no reason why ppl must devolve, even on a forum apparently without controls for this, to further make life miserable.

    You have 1 point, i did totally forget about the fact that resistance gets a 2x modifier so the actual final calculation in this case would be (user faith<97> + target faith<97>)*50% (-30)=67%
    what you don't address is that the calculation you used was wrong from the start and would result in totally biased results. Also of note is that you also forgot or even didn't even know about the 2x modifier
    . Please make sure to thank your friend for giving you the answer. All of this however does not change the fact that the calculation i provided for steal time is correct in the majority of situations barring where the target has charm resist.

    You haven't addressed the fact that you were wrong about how faith affects status effects either. Again ill say high faith increases the chance to apply and receive status effects. Can you reply to this?

    You have yet to confirm or deny the capability of the skills i mentioned to bypass dodge.(you stated dodge as a viable defense mechanism for Macherie) If you don't know there is no shame in saying so as all learning is a positive thing.

    You have cited tons of vc's and builds and hypothetical situations that are unrealistic
    (a thief sub Xiza would have 97 faith to maximize landing status effects and Macherie in all good sense situations would also have 97 faith to max her mag dmg etc) But what you haven't stated is that Macherie can only equip 1 vc and 1 esper at a time, so which 1 would you field her with to counter Xiza? (no need to respond here). If i had replied to these situations where you try to swing a bias in favor of Macherie the discussion would be endless as you can easily rotate the cards etc to suit the situation and that would be folly, so i focused on the skills brought up and how they would apply. 67% is still very high for Steal Time (yes I'm ignoring your vc wall of text as fleeting tranquility is a UR card and to max it and all of the cards you mentioned is super costly, i dont see how this would not be whale territory) but i did mention another skill Xiza can bring, Steal Time, another skill not affected by dodge and now the resistances Macherie bring are of no use as she wont even have the chance to cast them. These are just 2 skills of her entire kit that will mess up Macherie or most any units day.

    Yes anyone can pull a card or use the store but you have referenced all these cards, URs included at max level stat gains, so how is a ftp player going to do this? I am sure ftp players do not have unrestricted access to pulls for shards or limitless nrg refills to farm the books i mentioned or access to rainbow mats to build everything or unrestricted vis to purchase shards off the store. To field a well built Macherie (has anyone even done this?) that can compete at high lvls in all aspects of the game takes a massive investment of time/resources for FTP or... is whale business. That's the honest truth, if i am wrong however please post your Macherie, built as you have stated, to prove that anyone can do it.....

    You claim i am omitting info (which i am not) have you told your readers that when Macherie switches jobs she loses those skills you tout as being great. If she runs BM as you advise say goodbye to light /dark resist (isn't that how you advised to counter Xiza), if she is in cleric she loses drain/osmose and most of her dmg dealing kit, monk is a joke/meme. Are you really telling players to run a char with minimal dmg (monk sub) to take advantage of strike dmg on a primary magic unit??...really??. OK she hits Whisper for 10 dmg what next? (no resist buffs here btw except LB which also hits for peanuts and gives here resist to survive MAYBE 1 turn to hit again for ....10 dmg).....(bm sub) still lower than avg dmg no resist buffs and slow as hell to cast unless u have a maxed lvl UR vc...really?...(Cleric sub) 1 dmg skill, 1 healing skill ...She keeps her erase, esunaga and calamity guard throughout for all the good that will do for you against high lvl content hitting her and other units for 1/4 hp dmg.

    PVE: We have had 1 tower event, 1 raid event and 2 brutal events so far, there are only 3-4 missions in story that require you to step on a panel or some such. There are however 180+ missions in story. There have been book/char events each week since march some of which require hundreds of runs to farm, we are now in July and you advise to not care about auto AI?....really!!!?
    PVP: we have 4 modes to pvp in game, 1 of which is just for fun; of the remaining 3 only 1 is manually controlled.
    Yes i care about the Auto AI...hell yess in fact!

    I would advise players to learn the AI, learn how it changes to reductions and increases to agi, unit positioning, hate changes and anything else you can learn about it. It IS part of the game we play and if you ignore it and cant learn how to manipulate it to your advantage you will hamper your own progress. And note i HAVE NEVER said to rely on AI for harder content, this will ALWAYS be better manually controlled.

    I came here to challenge your false statements, i don't know you and have nothing against you personally. You say Macherie is a great unit players should invest in, i say she is totally passable and that players would find a better investment elsewhere. If i ignored certain statements it was because they were irrelevant to the real topic that i think needed actual discussion.

    I do care, as myself and I'm sure many others going by some comments in reddit, have been victim to reading and listening to erroneous guides posted by ppl in the early stages of the server. I hope that our "confrontation" will cause ppl to question the things you posted and maybe test them out.

    I don't care how you feel about this: your text has been argumentative and reeks of immaturity, you are more concerned with appearing to be correct while avoiding all the key points that players can take and use to better their gaming experience. You say you care about players? then own your mistakes and edit your original post with the correct info. Please do not reply as i wont read it and please, please give the readers accurate info to the best of your ability.
     
  8. SummonerBWM

    SummonerBWM VIP VIP Supporter

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    You have zero knowledge about me and ask if I was trolling on top of acting as though I never did played the game, so you should not be surprised if I take a shot on you and make question about you. You're the one who initiated it in this thread, so you yourself are the cause of it.

    Some of the people I've asked didn't even know about this, so we did research on it as there are no mentioning of it in relation to the GL side. Why did you think I said I did research? Not only that, but the places also used THAT formula to apply to status effects and it makes it as though it is for every single one.

    I did reply to it:

    I brought that up because it is assuming about Xiza having low faith and if Xiza attempt to have high faith to apply effects, then she will end up taking more magic damage. But then again, you as usual ignored it as you have been doing. I wasn't even wrong about anything about status effects at all as I was the one who made the reference about the method for faith.

    It's not biased if every info about faith and status effects on the GL side points to that, yet does not have any info at all about formulas used for status effects with their own mods, which JP has. Also, it doesn't even matter about me applying the 2x mod as I was using the formula that was given. If that 2x mod was even applied, it would make your point even more irrelevant as it would make the percentage 0. A lame attempt of trying to justifying your own fault and to pin blame.

    I brought up evasion/dodging as far as Xiza attempting to hit her with attacks such as Pummel or Terra Slash as they do damage. I already knew about Steal Heart as it does not do damage at all. But then again, you do not even bother wanting to learn as you want to make things negative such as you wanting to turn what is said about Macherie a negative thing.

    This shows how much you are igno and you wonder why I take shots at you. PvP takes 3 units into account, so I brought up those vcs because she can still benefit from the party abilities if other units also have it equipped as well. It is up to the player whether they want to equip her with espers and VCs that increase her strike or dark resist as well as boosting her MAG or any other aspect of her build. Also, who to say that Macherie even increase her faith to 97? I personally do not increase my faith to max on any one of my mages.

    Fleeting Tranquility is an MR. The fact you purposefully even ignore it proves me even more about you, especially with my last paragraph in my last post.

    And you still ignored the fact of me stating that Xiza still has to be within range to do that. Players would utilize their other units to occupy Xiza so that she would not get to Xiza and the fact that if Xiza is even attempting to have high faith, she will end up taking debuffs and ailments herself, even a poison and sleep from Macherie, something you prioritize so highly. You praise it so much that you forgot that Macherie also can take advantage of the very same thing you worship with her own debuff and ailment on top of the fact those two spells Macherie has in Bio and Sleep has 1 more Range Height than Xiza. So if someone ever attempt to get in to harm Macherie, another player (Or if the AI isn't stupid), can take advantage of the same faith formula to either have a chance to poison Xiza or put her to sleep for 3 turns. You give praise to the very same formula as though that is Xiza's win strategy and not realizing how much it is a double edge sword like the stat because she will suffer if she can't pull it off, especially for the fact she is weak to both light and magic attacks which Macherie specializes in.

    You did. You kept omitting and skipping my statement about low faith as well as what happens if Xiza tries to aim for higher faith and you believed that Fleeting Tranquility is an UR card which it is not. And I did mention Macherie about what she has when she pick one of the three sub jobs in my guide. Then again, you only cry for Xiza relying on Thief and don't even think about the flaws of what can happen with that as well as the status effect formula you tout as being great (Which I just talked about and showed the double-edged sword in that and shows you never even think about that kind of stuff).

    You claim that you do not omit info, yet you did anyway, because in my guide, I stated this:

    I brought up about anyone who has weak strike resistance and you ignored that and brought up Whisper.

    And once again, you ignored what I said... do you need glasses or do you need help with your amnesia:


    I never did even state in my last post about players should not caring about the AI to anyone. I myself for the guides I leave out and do not care for it due to the fact there is an AI update that needs to happen to toggle on and off and if there is any advice for AI, it would be not to really rely and be so dependent on it when it comes to other content in the game.

    If anything, they should get tips on which skill their unit should not learn yet until the AI update comes and because the AI can do something different with each unit and role, it is better for players to always seek and ask. Also, I never did say anything about you stating about relying on AI for harder content, so what in the world are you reading?

    I never did say Macherie is a great unit. I said she is one overlooked and players should not pass her by as she has feats she can do and is built in ways other units may not be able to do or even at all.

    OH! I thought you do not omit! So you're lying and contradicting yourself as well! You shouldn't if you're going to debate and want to share disagreements about something. How hypocritical!

    ::vplaugh:: HILAAARIOUS! Coming in like a Nazi Correctional Po Po thinking he is bringing justice while trying to call someone a troll and they don't really play the game when you:

    1. Left out the 2x part for resistance.
    2. Is flawed in that the status effect formula you praise for is a double edge sword.
    3. Came in here already disrespectful aiming to insult, which in and of itself is already wrong on your part in the first place.
    4. Purposefully leave out statements I made to make yourself right, which I have to repeatedly quote myself.
    5. COMPLETELY BELIEVED that I was taking shots at your personal playstyle, which I never did until you started to insult (And why? Because I said for you to research about the faith formula, which in and of itself is not wrong at all? Ridiculous).

    Those five compared to what, me not knowing that there is another formula (Which there is so many math formulas that even FFBE doesn't even have) which is not even in any of the current GL sources. You're in the wrong. I was completely respectful and I didn't mind at all about any disagreements and opinions. I don't mind and I do not know everything, but once you start trying to insult, all restraints are off.

    ::joy:: Boy please. If anything, they will question you and your true intentions, especially for someone who is not interested in "petty confrontations". You are more erroneous in approach and mindset than those who do make guides. You don't go taking whatever experience you had on Reddit and go thinking you will make a difference on another site, because as you just did, brought more harm than good.

    ASTOUNDING! ::joy:: You are THE LAST person to tell someone they're immature when you're the one who barged in my guide just looking for an argument and refusing to apologize and humble out, realizing that your way of even talking to me was the wrong and disrespectful way of doing it. Nothing of what I said, besides not knowing about the status effect formula, which some players didn't even know as well when I asked around until all of us looked and found something on the JP side, is wrong in and of itself. It is also ironic for you to talk about me appearing to be correct, yet you, and stated yourself while also contradicting, purposefully ignore statements that are relevant because you deem it irrelevant and refuse to admit that you yourself are wrong. When are you going to own up your own mistakes? Don't care if you won't read and I will be glad you won't. Please grow up in mind and spirit, learn how to properly talk to someone, and learn how to apply statements to your own self, because you are amateur at the best of your own ability. Do not dare post in this thread or any of my future guide or I will immediately report. This is a warning.
     

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