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What do you actually give a shit about in the game anymore?

Discussion in 'General' started by Kain Darkwind, Feb 21, 2021 at 6:28 PM.

  1. Kain Darkwind

    Kain Darkwind Ascended Member

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    Ok, so this thread title probably sounds like a troll, but it's not. 100% serious.

    At first (and I've played this game for a long ass time, all the way back to the Golbez banner. No, not Black Mage Golbez, just Golbez), what I liked about the game was just about damn near everything.

    Story: towns to explore, adventure sites to explore, things to find from Raven and his thieves' guild, and a fairly interesting cast of characters to follow.
    Weekly Events: Fun content from old FF games, reinterpreted through the FFBE lens. Some of it was really challenging too, like Kefka!
    Holiday Events: Some of these things were really different and not cookie cutter at all, like one that was timed how long you could be in the dungeon, and another one that you could participate in by collecting eggs (or some shit) from other stages, not necessarily the Vortex.
    New Units: Loved to see and comment on who should have been a 4* base vs 3*. Later on, loved to do it with 5* bases and who got upgrades to 6* final form. (Before it was automatically set to all 4*s and no 3*s.)
    Trials: They were hard! But not insane mechanics that ignored all of your useful mechanics. And they provided pretty sweet rewards, things that were head and shoulders above anything other than the best trust master rewards. (Which were just as hard if not harder to get than trial rewards, prior to moogles) 10 Man Trials is still one of my favorite pieces of content.
    Colosseum: I didn't know how useless the Blood Sword was going to be!
    Espers: Believe it or not, we actually used to like espers for their stat boosts, and not the killers they offered. Some people even used esper special abilities.
    Final Esper Dungeon: Bahamut's island was awesome. Super high challenge, rewarding to complete, rewarding to farm.


    Then, and I'm going to just call this 'Season 2', even if some of this stuff was phased in prior...

    Story: Akstar, Madam Edel and the Orders in general were super cool additions to the roster. Seeing the Veritas without their armor was also sweet. Having interesting characters generated interest for these units. And recovering the stuff for Madam Edel was a worthy season 2 counterpart to the thieves' guild. But, less towns had stuff to explore, and explorations of adventure sites decreased. In many ways, the content for Season 2 felt more 'phoned in' than Season 1.
    Weekly Events: These were reduced to auto-destroy trash grinds that gave almost entirely trash rewards. You had three types: Mog, Raid, and Story. Story events sometimes were pretty interesting, and had a difficult cap at the end, which was like a mini-trial.
    Holiday Events: These were also phased into the above 'three type' format, and typically had trash rewards. Some people like to defend these trash rewards as 'beginner rewards', despite beginners not having any use for them either. Very rarely you'd find a diamond in the rough that was awesome. (Dodge Roll, Moogle Charm, I'm looking at you.)
    New Units: 7* era saw the utter demise of the 4* base unit. These were now trash on release, along with 3* units. There were still units to look forward to, thanks to the story still going along.
    Trials: New types of trials included Scorn, Series Boss Battles and Global Unique fights. Some of them were cool, but rewards started to slack compared to the difficulty of the fight and comparative (or nakedly superior) equipment options in the game. Over promised levels of trials sort of marked this era for me.
    Arena: This replaced Colosseum and ultimately turned into a waste of time. No prize is worth the amount of lapis the leaderboard has to spend on refills, and there's nothing to generate the interest in doing it over and over again.
    Espers: 3* esper era, which were themselves mini-trials were fun. Killers on espers were now obviously the best choice. No one cares about their stat boosts.
    Final Esper Dungeon: Asura's island was cool the first time through, but...you couldn't steal from enemies, you couldn't farm Xp...it wasn't as sweet as Bahamut's.


    and now, what I'll call 'Season 3', but mainly mean 'NV era'
    Story: The Darkness is stealing colors. Or love. Christ, I hate the story now. To be fair, I'm not out of Music World yet. Maybe it gets better, but this used to be my favorite part and it's shit now. But at least there's...no towns to explore, almost zero explorations (and those are super short), no NPC quests, nothing akin to Thieves' Guild/Madam Manor, all content here is comically weak, and I just really wanted something stronger for Fina's season than this Carebear Stare fuckery. No character introduced so far really makes me want to get them as a unit. Which is fantastic, since they decided to skip releasing them entirely.
    Weekly Events: Still trash grinds that give almost entirely trash rewards. We get three types: Mog, Raid, and Elemental/Wave. This last type combines the NRG of the Mog with the garbage rewards of a Raid. The few times you'll see story events anymore, they've been divested of their moderately challenging last stage.
    New Units: NV era sees the utter demise of the 5* base unit. They are now trash on release and there are no more 3* or 4* units. You can tell, because certain 'late era' 7* rainbow units are more useful/powerful than current 7* rainbow units.
    Trials: There are no new types of trials, and the trials that are released feel wearisome. Their rewards aren't great, their mechanics are stupid 99% damage reduction phases, it seems like all of them have ways to ignore any of the mechanics you have to survive. They typically require a fairly sound strategy, and don't lend themselves well to discovering that strategy via play (compared to say, watching Sinzar.)
    Dark Visions: Not bad as far as content goes, but it quickly lost my interest.
    Arena: This is somehow even worse than before.
    Espers: No new esper era. No new esper power ups.
    Final Esper Dungeon: See above.


    I honestly am starting to feel the same way about this game as I did a few years ago when I caught myself mindlessly refreshing Facebook to see if anything had changed in the last five minutes...it wasn't even something I cared about, but it had become such a habit that I did it anyways.

    I don't care about NV units, not really. I have enough of the earlier ones that I can beat most trials if I bother to at least give lip service to a viable strategy. (And any one that I just walk into blind beats me like an ugly red headed stepchild, Faisy or no Faisy.)

    The things I would get excited for aren't on the horizon. NVAs of some of my old characters would be interesting, but I'd like them done in a way that doesn't invalidate 90% of their old kit. A massive overhaul of the arena reward system. Scorn of the 10 Man Trials. Adjusting the Item World enhancements and format. Increasing story and weekly content's difficulty level to a point where it is not pointless, but doesn't include stupid trial 'boss is immune' mechanics.

    I dunno, it's been creeping up on me for a few months now, but I'm honestly wondering why I'm still playing the game. It really isn't offering much of anything at this point other than excuses for why it's being sucking.

    So that brings us back to the original question: what do you actually give a shit about in the game anymore? Dark Visions? New units on the horizon? The story?
     
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  2. Seph1roth5

    Seph1roth5 Ascended Member

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    See so many of these lol, if you don't like it, stop playing, doesn't matter what you don't like. Am I the only one that stops playing games when they're not fun? Sure seems like it.

    Replace "continue to play ffbe" with "keeping your hand on a hot stove"
     
  3. TheWillAndTheWay

    TheWillAndTheWay Ascended Member Supporter

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    Everything.

    I like everything.

    Why?

    Everything you mentioned is still in game, nothing was taken away.

    Power creep is normal like in MMOs.
     
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  4. aa25

    aa25 VIP VIP

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    My latest fun part is this boss rush. Don't remember what was the previous one. Perhaps, the

    I'm with you though. To me, it is baffling that the devs more or less stop/throw away things that people like about the game and focus on just one thing that cater only a subset of playstyle/player base.

    I wish they realize soon that this model will only attract a subset of players, while the game itself has potential to attract more groups of people. I don't really understand why they decide it this way.

    I guess, the bottom line is, yeah, I am in the same boat asking myself why I am still playing this game, lol. Well, one answer is probably waiting for stuffs like this boss rush to happen.
     
  5. SlightlyDubious

    SlightlyDubious A Wild Dubs Appears! Spooky Chocobro Valkyrie Æsir VIP Supporter

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    Honestly, most of the time it feels like I'm playing out of habit now. For months, I've primarily been logging in to do daily summons (I don't really do arena, ad wheel, or daily missions anymore), and wrapping up most weekly events within the first day or two to nab rewards and ignore them the rest of the time. I don't care about the season 3 story, and I don't do more than a single pass through DV when it's around and don't care much about my score. I usually only have one or two items to pop through IW, so 90% of the time it's up I ignore it.

    I wouldn't really call the game "fun" anymore, at least not for me, but it's still a good enough time waster if I don't have anything else to do during my breaks at work considering I've long-since deleted all of my other mobile games. I miss the days when I was genuinely enthusiastic about logging in, but I've been resigned to the fact that those days are gone for me, and likely not coming back unless there's a (highly unlikely) overhaul to the state of things. That said, I've stick around this long, I'll probably just keep lazily putzing around until it's gone.

    I think the one thing I do look forward to are NVA units, though the past couple of months, and the most recent news has put a bit of a damper on that front. I also still like building friend units for other people to use, but i can generally do that on a single 10 minute work break as-needed, so it doesn't really contribute much to my game time.

    Absolutely no judgments at all to the people who are still genuinely enjoying things, and still get excited for weekly releases.
     
  6. Talien

    Talien Element resistl0rd VIP Supporter

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    I enjoy seeing how badly gumpi fails with each update so I can at least have a good laugh. The excuses and fake apologies given in the livestreams are a riot.
     
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  7. r00t61

    r00t61 Ascended Member

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    GLumi does not understand how to re-use their content properly. This is why we are stuck farming totally trivial time-limited event content that only requires hitting the "Repeat" button, while slowly gaining currency for "rewards" that do little more than cause you to have to go play another tedious round of "Inventory Manager" with your overflowing glob of cactuars and turtles.

    The most difficult/challenging/interesting content in FFBE is a trial - which for the sake of argument, is the same as a MMO dungeon boss or raid. GLumi has to devote lots of programmer resources to develop and debug the AI and art assets. Therefore, in order to maximize the return on investment, trials are what we *should* be farming repeatedly. Boss Rush is a limited form of this, but since it only comes around once in a blue moon, it is not a suitable alternative.

    Imagine daily or weekly missions that gave you rewards for beating current trials, e.g.,

    - Beat Scorn of Asura OR Scorn of Omega OR Scorn of Shinryu for basic reward - lapis, tickets, etc
    - Beat one of the above trials using only 5 units for better reward - STMR tickets, UOCs, dark matter, etc
    - Beat one of the above trials using at least 1 unit that is 7-star max - Unit fragments, red pearls, etc
    - Beat one of the above trials without any dupes - Omniprism, "real" enhancement upgrade materials

    What do I mean by "real" upgrade mats? Let's first address another large problem in FFBE - the uneven and sometimes exponentially spiky power creep. This unbalance might make it "totally hype" when it comes to pulling for a shiny new unit that does 100x more damage than the previous meta, but it's ultimately unsustainable and only hurts the game long term.

    In any balanced RPG, farming a boss repeatedly gives you a slow but steady power creep. Every new piece of gear/skill upgrade/stat boost that you earn might increase your overall output by only 0.5-1% (be it DPS, healing, tank mitigation, etc), but when you add that all up, you might end up at +20%. Or whatever number makes it feel as though you can go from "Man, that boss was the toughest thing I ever did" to "I can make mistakes but still win in the end".

    In FFBE, the power steps are too jagged and pronounced from tier to tier. Instead, bosses should be dropping materials that can increase your base ATK+1, your base HP+5, increase the mod of a skill by 1x, etc. They could extend this to IW-type boosts too - imagine getting a sword +1 ATK or a rod +1% MAG, but these can stack on your weapon, and don't have to get wiped over and over in the current IW format - they're permanent.

    Rolling out these rewards in the slow and steady fashion means they can manage powercreep better, while you as the player get to feel gradual accomplishment - which is the hallmark of toon progression in any RPG, and continually makes farming these trial bosses easier with each win. They could even make these boosts part of a recipe that depends on unit prisms/fragments - which simultaneously puts a gate on the progress while tying it together with the gacha - now when you get your 17th copy of Lightning, your reaction is "well I can use her to add +1 ATK to my Esther's stats" instead of "why God why do you hate me so?"
     
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  8. TheKillingJoke

    TheKillingJoke Doomicorn VIP

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    Pff. No clue what ye all have a problem with. FFBE is the best menu animation simulator you can get!
     
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  9. pete146

    pete146 Ascended Member

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    For me the problem is that there are no rewards worth chasing anymore! It used to be exciting to get a TMR, or a limited weapon from a KM event. Now, the only kit that people want is STMR's - the TMR's are outdated, the KM events and RAID events don't give anything that we need, crafting is a joke. It's hard to get motivated to grind events when you don't get anything great for your effort!

    For me the game used to be about the story - now it's about gearing units. I don't get any joy from putting gear on a unit, taking it off and putting something else on them (especially as the game makes this pretty hard work!). The challenge used to be about Tanking, Healing, surviving and chaining. Now it's about elements, killers and unit rotation - it's a clever move as it puts the emphasis on needing more 'stuff'.

    Yes Yes I get it - if I don't like it then I should stop playing. But like many of us I have years invested in this game (and quite a bit of money) and I really want to see it through to whatever the end is! I stick with it in the hope that Gumi will regain my interest again with content that I WANT to complete.
     
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  10. Syuri

    Syuri ♥ evade prince, kupo!! ♥ VIP Supporter

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    Maybe because
    • i invest lots of time in this game since released
    • already 90% familiar with mechanic/system/battle/event/etc
    • Already have quite bunch of units
    • Can collect favorite ff units in 1 game
    • Since the game still running, thus i'm still playing..

    Start another game means needs to gacha/learn again, and eventually repeated what i already did in ffbe.. so yeah lets stick to one and do another thing irl..
     
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  11. illy

    illy i'll make a cup of coffee for your head VIP Supporter Arena Runner-Up S1

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    over the last year, i've generally spent 5 minutes on the game mon-fri, then if i have time, abit more on the weekend
    so yeh... not quite sick of the game yet like most here lol

    maybe i'll finish chamber of arms / season 2 soon!
     
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  12. SadPanda

    SadPanda Ascended Member

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    I completely agree with the OP. The first time I stepped into this world, the thing I was immediately wrapped up in is the story and exploration. I wanted to keep going so I could see what was going to happen, and I felt like the world was huge and I wanted to explore it. This feeling continued into season 2; I know some didn't like the story in season 2 but I still enjoyed it and would rush through all new chapters as soon as they were released. But all of that has been destroyed in season 3. The story is absolutely terrible, it goes from mind-numbingly boring to ridiculous to just plain weird (which is where I'm at right now). And there's pretty much no sense of exploration anymore, just a bunch of disjointed worlds with nothing to do.

    Lack of content has been well documented by now. The weekly events are trivial and are more of an obligation than worth doing for any sort of reward; really the only reason I grind them now is for the pearls. Arena/colosseum have absolutely no purpose. Trials have become mundane. DV is pretty much the only content the game has now, but for those of us that don't like the format it's largely just a nuisance or something that you skip entirely.

    The biggest issue I have is that there just isn't a sense of progression anymore. Shiny new units are released every week, but outside of maybe DV there's zero reason to actually try to get them. There's no gear worth grinding for outside of maybe STMRs, and even then there's no content to even use your new powerful units on. I had high hopes for the NV system because I thought it might give us something to build towards, but there's no real reason to take a unit past +1 unless you just really like the unit. And I already have so many materials for ability upgrades that I can easily upgrade any new unit's abilities to +5 as soon as I get them. I have issues with a number of things in WOTV, but one of the things they got right is the sense of progression and always having something to work towards.

    I know some would say "well just quit", and ultimately that's what I may end up doing if something doesn't change. But given how much we all have invested in this game, it's easy to retain some level of hope that things will get better. What I really want to see is some other publisher do a Final Fantasy game with classic mechanics. WOTV is good if you like Tactics-style combat, but it's still the same publisher at the end of the day. Opera Omnia isn't bad, but I personally hate that style of combat so it gets boring quickly for me. I'd love someone to basically take a stab at creating an FFBE-like game, but one that re-establishes the sense of progression we all had early on.
     
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  13. Polka!

    Polka! Ascended Member Supporter

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    gotta say this week’s boss rush was pretty fun, with good rewards. Trying to do them from memory instead of watching videos or looking up wiki was fun for me. I actually used Myra on my team to do the last series, used two 7* units instead of all these NV’s I got and it was a nice feeling.
     
  14. Arashi

    Arashi "Hall of Fame" Member

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    I always see story and exploration listed as the main reason people hate the current game. I guess that's why I'm fine with it, I never gave two shakes about the story or exploration. I wanted the dang quest rewards, I don't have time to learn about your sad backstory! This event lasts for only two weeks and I'm on a short lunch break! And exploration always felt like a chore with having to run with touch controls (which I always hate) and the annoying random encounters. Yes I know random encounters are a part of FF, but in main games, I need those for grinding exp or items. In this game, they just serve to annoy me. And then there's all the town quests that frankly are pretty much useless. I have to go explore and beat up a bunch of a specific enemy to get what? 5 echo herbs? the only quests that seemed worth doing were the key quests, which again needed more exploration quests that frankly are too bothersome to do on my own and I would just look up the locations anyway.

    I'm here for gacha and to put together a wacky-ass team of units from FF games I like. And this game still gives me that. Complain all you want about 7*'s and NV's and "rate up is a lie", this is still one of the most generous gacha games I ever played. Free 10+1 summons, free summon tickets (that summon a FULL unit and not 2 shards out of a 200 shard unit that isn't even good), free event units, a lot of free equipment, no actual content locked behind a paywall (everyone gets access to the same trials and events no matter if you're whale or FTP), and free premium currency that isn't locked behind paid/free distinction.
     
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  15. TheWillAndTheWay

    TheWillAndTheWay Ascended Member Supporter

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    I agree with this completely.

    One of the best challenges in the game is doing it blind or using a team out of fun not due to meta.

    Meta can be fun too.
     
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  16. ShinJay

    ShinJay Ascended Member

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    They should have something similar to Dragon Quest Tact Battle Road where it cost no NRG to attempt unit family (Beast, Slime, Undead, Demon, Golem, Inorganic, Mystery) missions which are for mainly units of low tier, similar to 1*-3* in FFBE. For example: FFBE should maybe have 0 NRG attempt for 1*-3* which would make for lots of interesting battles and maybe Nightmare difficulty of boss battles, maybe after clearing it first.

    But, for me, its mainly collecting the daily rewards and looking forward to the next unit banner.
     
  17. Talien

    Talien Element resistl0rd VIP Supporter

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    There was supposed to be stuff for just 3* and 4* units, but gumpi failed as usual and said TMR/STMR would make it too easy and dropped it instead of doing something sensible like restricting STMR use.
     
  18. Thiago Amorim Neves Reis

    Thiago Amorim Neves Reis "Hall of Fame" Member

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    Enjoyed boss Rush a lot, as always the trick is not read thw guides trough. And getting BahaFina was way too enjoyable
     
  19. Kain Darkwind

    Kain Darkwind Ascended Member

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    No, this is demonstrably false. Literally most of those old event types are not found any longer in the game. And I'm not sure how to explain the difference between fun consumed content and fun 'yet to be' consumed content.

    And the question wasn't really what you like, but what you care about, which is slightly different. I'm glad you like "everything". If you are finding some point to colosseum runs and arena, more power to you. I certainly don't want to drag down someone having fun with the game; it was great fun for me for a few years. Nothing's grabbing me anymore, and my question was a serious one...I do want to know what people are finding compelling about the game as it currently stands. What do you most look forward to each week? A new NV unit? NVA? DV? QOL, ABC, 123?

    Power creep is normal, no doubt. What is irksome about how FFBE powercrept is that it hit a point where 99% of the content was irrelevant in challenge. The only power that was crept was unit power, not the in game content.

    r00t61 was spot on that Gumi isn't reusing their content in a sustainable way. They keep jumping all over the fucking place. We needed awakening materials, then crysts, then latent points, and all of a sudden they just stopped with all of that. The crafting system is fake news. Each of those systems should have added a different sort of power up. Consider if 'ability awakenings' crysts from the getgo, allowed you to slowly and continually boost your unit's modifiers, durations, percentages, etc., instead of in two lurching jumps. And then latent ability points added actual powers to your character's kit. Grinding bosses is exactly what we should be encouraged to do in the game, whether it is to gain power up materials, or item shards for the top tier equips, or whatever. This isn't just good for the game...it's good for Gumi too. As it currently stands, there is almost no reason to repeat the content that they've spent the most time designing and working on. That's not sustainable. Consider the Veritas trial. You do it once, get a reward, and done. But what if that reward was a recipe for the Darksword or whatever the hell you got from it, and beating the Veritas dropped materials for making the sword? Now, if you want five of those swords, you grind out the Veritas trial until you've got enough. Also, I would have absolutely added the ability to steal something unique from each of them. I'd also add a random drop for improvement recipes, so you can also turn two darkswords into a darksword +1, and two darksword +1s into a darksword +2, and so on. Maybe random steal too. Now I've got a permanent piece of content in the game that people can do over and over again, because they want to get the full Boltlord kit of armor, accessory, helm and weapon, and they want to max out the Veritas weapons. Now I've got something sustainable, because instead of one and done, for a few manhours more programming work, I've given a reason to keep accessing that content.

    Explorations...hard mode. Doesn't have to be complicated. Toss a x10 or x100 stat modifier (maybe this is hard mode and extra hard mode!) on the stuff that showed up in the easy mode, and give some sort of grindable resource to get. The less 'one and done' you have in your permanent content, the better.
     
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  20. FaRFrOmPoOpIn

    FaRFrOmPoOpIn "Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya........" VIP Supporter

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    i miss grinding Miranda Coast for flour so i could bake shit.
     

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